Official No Match Discussion Thread

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Bring 48hr wars into ee with 100 vs 100.
Let's get some old school play back into this game.
Also limit the combined stat range from strongest to weakest in a clan when signing up for wars.
 
upgrading my idea before...

Create 3 option for clan to join EE war...
1. small pool range 1-3 mcs
2. medium pool range 3mcs+1-10 mcs
3. heavy pool range 10mcs+1-unlimited for now

when matchmaking drop all clan to that pool 1/2/3..., clan couldn't drop at any pool will disqualification and can't do tvp..., then matchmaking each member of pool..., clan had no match awarding to run tvp...

this will make clan owner/admin to create roster with they want to match..., maybe RH will always match to Sotra but its at equal with their build roster..., if want match with other type clan so they can build another roster to medium pool or heavy pool...

No need anymore dtw/dts, skill, tactic, player activity at war, and strategic will more important to win the war...

pool system like this could be implement to pvp war too..., so no complaint big stat bullied mid stat or mid stat bullied new player...

thank you for reading devs, kaw_admin
 
Just to reiterate, if there is going to be any serious consideration of separate war tiers, based on stats:

1) it MUST be based on building stats PLUS bfe PLUS bfa (cutoff values are quite different than what they would be if they were based on building stats only)

2) it SHOULD have overlap between ranges, so people at or near the cutoff point have some overlap where they could either enter the lower tier or the higher tier, for example

0-5m for the lowest rank
3-17m for the middle rank
14 for the highest rank

So if you were a 2m cs SH that had 10m bfa and 300m bfe, that's 2m plus 10/50m for bfa (0.2m) plus 300/50m for bfe (6m) for a total power of 8.2m total, which puts you squarely into the middle tier where you belong.

If you wanted to be the toughest guy in the bottom tier, with a 5m max total power, your 2m for buildings plus 0.2m for bfa leaves you with 2.7999 worth of bfe to stay under that 5m cutoff point--- so you could select equipment that keeps you just under 5m total

But those two things are important to think about--- overlap in tiers means that you have some leeway when your building stats are in a certain range to either be the small guy on one tier or the big guy on another tier, and you could switch from one battle to the next if you felt like it. And tiers absolutely must be based on buildings PLUS bfa PLUS bfe, not just building stats. Every power evaluation has to be like that to be meaningful.
 
The issue isn't the build its just the out-dated game mechanics. small builds (midgets !!) have a very very low raw CS but they have high BFA/BFE thats where the problem because of that they can hit and win on builds that are more then 15 mil raw CS !!!.
everyone says and knows this is a war game. when a strong soldier gets injured in battlefield a midget can come and win the last attacks on him/her. why ? because that strong soldier is injured and cant use his all power. the midget uses the BFA/BFE he has to do the final blow.

the problem that comes next is not the win that that midget has its the huge PLUNDER that he gets !! a midget build can plunder much much higher then he can chew that shouldn't happen its logic !! if you are a midget you must not take huge plunder from a strong player that has high raw status. in EE wars we all know that a attack KO gives you around 600 - 800 mil (clan plunder included) this is where all the problem is not the mechanic of a midget can win from strong build.

to solve this devs should have algorithms that doesn't allow midgets to have high plunder even if they attack KO in ee war !! the next problem here is that even if that is solved clans will stack GH/SH in to there rooster to get a match against clans that have lower mids and tops.

lets say devs gonna solve the problem by having stronger builds earn same as GH/SH plundering from strong builds. if that happens the GH/SH will just sacrifice themselves attacking with no pots and sko immediately. then why should clans still have midgets in there rooster ?? because they want there hit/ratio to get lower and to get a good match for themselves.
these exploits will never be solved until the game mechanics change !!! game mechanic is out-dated and with these new lands/eb/equips devs should have also changed there game mechanics which they haven't done. they haven't done anything to the basic system of this game which is PLUNDER gold. it hasn't changed within raw status builds it has remained the same. small and weak soldiers gets more plunder when they attack stronger builds !!

The only way to solve this is to ban midgets from doing ee war but that isn't fair ! its like during a war you want an army of same strong status !! that has never been done in any war. in every army you see ranks of soldiers so is in this game and commanders are smart to put those ranks in right places to win a war.
 
Yep, hit range is not the problem, matching and plunder are. That's what I keep saying. The plunder solution is such an easy one, just need to switch the plunder calc system back to more or less the original one. Really no idea why it was changed in the first place, it always worked fine. My only guess at the time (right around when SoS was introduced, and the tower zombie fiasco and all that) there was a fundamental change to how plunder worked. That was the moment the system was broken. Switching back to the original system where buildings have a set cap and you earn that value as long as you're not attacking someone way weaker than you, that's the starting point for a correction. I proposed a slightly modified take on the original system that should be implemented, it ought to fix everything with regard to the SH problem, more or less. Just need to dial in the scale factors and the stat ratio thresholds.
 
Maybe take the best quotes and ideas that you will consider and lock them in a separate thread.

This thread is long and we don't know which parts kaw are considering.
 
I put one hand up for facelesskilers suggestion of 48 hour war
Long war means work/sleep/school is involved Its fun when you have a 'war' not a giant splooge of troops and yer done.
The clans that dominate will be filled with no RL obligations, so top rancor will give them some importance, and the rest of us will have fun warring
 
PLUNDER math based on building cap so its difficult to change for EE war because its will affect to EB player too...

for instant change for this season 3 EE war is changed hit restriction to max 100% based on building stat not including bfe/ bfa..., so who have stat 2mcs only could hit max 4mcs..., this will make admin think to stack gh/sh/lb..., mix at medium is a great choice with few gh/sh/lb stat...

if hit retriction based on build stat + bfe + bfa so will like tmh example..., 2mcs stat build but with bfa and bfe will become 8,2 mcs stat so could hit higher than 10 mcs or more...
 
so bfe and bfa will become advantage only for harder to hit or ko'ed..., need more player to ko'ed player with great bfe and bfa but not affect too much at plunder what based to win a war...

so its will make a fair war and more fun...
 
@kaw_admin, you can bring back the following for a good start:

step 1: do not deduction rancors for losing a war
benefits: Increased participation, every war person had enough chances to get max rancors hence reducing unbalanced in bfe

step 2: limit variations within roster (smallest participant must not be dtw to the bigest participant)
benefits: reduced variations would restrict the ability to stack over weighted LB with GH or SoSH thereby reducing mismatch

these are two simple task to begin with and if you can't even do this then you should stop asking for advice which i read are mostly relatively more complicated to the 2 proposed above.
 
@Was the problem you have with your second idea is some SH or SHT with a stack of bfe can reach more than 70% of the roster so stacking will still occur, so great idea in theory but wont solve the problem
Im actually coming round to the idea of nullifying bfa - would solve the problem of powerful midgets and lb stacking, whilst also solving the issue of mass ally hiring after match up ... And this is coming from someone who loves having bfa lol
Bfe wouldn't need to be nullified as the same system now can be used and equipments not changed after match-ups
Theres some great ideas on here but i dont know im more with the keep it simple brigade i think over-complicating things has lead us to where we are now
 
Before I post my idea how to fix EE war problems, let me go over 3 points
1st, no matter what changes you do there is always complainer especially the ones abusing the system.
2nd, players and clans always gonna try to look for the twist to get easy matches.
3rd. The system doesn't have to adapt to clans structure. Clans have to adapt to the system.
Now my solution:
Till now the only requirement at sign up is the number of ppl that has cast woc (20 ppl at this moment)
You only need to add one more requirement and is that within the players signing up, that the strongest can be able to hit and be hit by the smallest in the roster. If not the system will tell the admin "Your clan can't sign up because an unbalance roster" and admins have 4 hrs to figure a better roster.
This will stop all the crazy roster that the system can not even calculate and are creating no-matches, mismatches and abuses to the system, big accounts will be warring big accounts and small accounts will war small accounts the way it should be.
This will change everything how clans are structure till now, leaving more balance clans. Like before clan's owners will have to create sub-clans to move the small accounts and that will result in more clans warring, each one in a deferent strength against clans with similar strength.
This will also solve a problem that KAW is having now and is the no need to grow, cuz the way EE war are set is better to be small and keep and warring with the big boys.
And for the LBs explosion u need to lower the gap on combing BFA for 2 clans to be match.
Last question: when this should take place? The season should take one week off now for tryouts that way more player will have the chance to earn equipments ( is sad, the way the system is set now, no many ppl gonna end with 50 rancors and the majority of the ones reaching 50 will be the ones abusing the system)
 
Can we just make this simple? The amount of no matches is ridiculous this season. We didn't have this problem season 2 or preseason. Whatever u did screwed things up, just undo it.

Also for all of us that prepare and plan our time around the wars, It'd be nice if a no match gave us 1 rancor; it's not enough for people to abuse the system, yet gives us something for our efforts
 
As I see it the biggest problem with war is on the side of SOS lvl1 builds SH/GH builds. If you have an attack build most clans are requiring 2mil sdt minimum to war with them. While that aid against assassination of troops it does very little to thwart the scout bombing.

As most people should know or be aware of the whole thing with GH/SH is that they can scout bomb people whose spy defense is 5 time theirs own spy attack numbers. They are able to do this because sdp and sdt are not impacting spy actions.

A GH/SH who scout bombs a heavy spy build with 5mil spy defense fully potted with mith spells and sdt has no problem getting through even though the SH/GH only has 800k cs for spy attack. And they are sucrssful at that. Very few 800k spy attack GH/SH ever fail a scout.

I have a 5mil spy def cs. I get scouted by 800k cs spy attack SH/GH and he don't fail. This is really unrealistic in nature. Oh yeah that's partially because he can use spy attack pots to boost his strength yet my defending spies don't get pot bonus to defend. Also the sdt has little to no affect either.

GH/SH are so coveted for this reason. They are pisser spy builds whose soul purpose is to Deplete spies. They are not exspected to plunder. They will get plunder by getting KOs on ppl 6times there size. Not only that but when they scout a bigger spy build they lose less spies than the bigger defender on scouting. When the bigger spy scouts the GH/SH guess what. The bigger guy loses more spies still. The scout mechanics of these wars are what is destroying it.

They need to be changed to have sdt and sdp (spy defensive pots) account on these scout actions. A 800k spy attack should not be able to be successful every single scout action against a highly defensive spy build. These actions should be costly to the GH/SH and the fail rate for them should be alot higher than they are. This is one of the major issues surrounding GH/SH.

That's why all these stacked teams win wars. Just look at actions. Look at the rediculous number of scout actions these teams have. And it is directly a result if the scout attack vs defense mechanics.
 
Split wars into two leagues. Keep your matching the same based on bfa/bfe ect. Roaster sizes can be determined later, Rewards in this league are 50% of rewards in larger league (edge/mith) to promote growth. Less equip rewarded at the end of season. This league would host 0-5m cs. Minimize no matches dude to hit ratio, decrease plunder exploits and increase participants.

League two would host 5m cs and above. Same rewards as now. Decrease no matches and increase participation, less 15m cs hansels dropping to sh.

Few ideas 
 
I think devs need to focus on:

1.Finding a suitable hit range, IMO the current cs difference in which players can still hit eachother without dtw/dts is too wide.

2. As has been mentioned , looking into a players "true strength" (bfa/bfe) for payouts.

3. Tweaking equip. Equip should not allow a player to up hit outside of normal cs hit ratio. It should also have restrictions to upgrades based on lands/buildings. Maybe incorporate an upgrade to the Mage at a certain hf land or a certain CS .
This can work with all equip or certain equip. Either way it will force players to upgrade. I guess current warriors would have to be grandfathered in , or you could freeze their enchantments.
 
if the devs split EE wars into multiple leagues, people would stay at they very top of the league. This would not work very well.
 
I thought I'd put my personal input in there too.

What do u want to promote with EE?
a) strategy during war?
b) strategy before war?

Today we're in case b) as even with so many no matches, most of the matches people get are still very uneven. Some clans came up with impressive roster strategies (LB stacked roster, LB-GH, LB-PS or even a mix of it) and the only problem there is that there are too many no matches: open up ur criteria.

If u want to promote a), then you may need to review completely your matchup algorithm. Season 1 was according to me the best so far for even matchups. We had our share of fair fights where we really didn't know who would win until shortly before war end.
The difference is you weighted individual power and not the clan as a whole.

Result is easy: a clan with an even roster against a clan with very big and very small members shouldn't match! The bigs are too big to be plundered from an the small don't pay: where do u get plunder from then?

If you want even matches u gotta match top with top, middle with middle, bottom with bottom and not clan by clan directly.
Plunder is key to win wars so weight the plunder chances (success chance full to full*pay) from one roster to the other (a PS gives 0 plunder, top LB gives 0.1% chance of success)

Maybe separate attk power from spy power in matchup algorithm (it could bring Hansels back in the game).

In any case, without changes like u said, only way to solve no-match issue is open up ur criteria and being aware that EE is about how to build the best line up.
 
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