Also want to say that all the response are great feedback too. I read them all. I'm not going to weigh in on this right now though, because it always ends up in a huge debate and I'm trying to get some banners out that are waaaaayyyyy overdue. But keep debating, we do read as much as we can on the forums and do our best to listen. One thing I would suggest is to keep in mind that we do have a lot of data about wars and we do our best to balance what is actually happening with what people see is happening, and what people want to happen. It's tough and because wars are so competitive, people are not always rational with their feedback and responses. Every time a competitive clan looses a match at least someone in the clan screams 'Bad MATCH BAD MATCH!'. I investigate nearly every one of these complaints. Most of the time the matchup might be a little lopsided but within a competitive range, and the clan's other matchups have been good. Telling a angry person who just lost that this is the case is an exercise in futility. Next thing to remember is that the leaderboard is not simply based on strength, it also takes into account wins and losses, so be mindful of this when you look at matchups and see a LB players on the roster.
When we refer to leaderboard we refer to Allie leaderboard as it's the only one that really counts for anything
We don't have enough clans warring to support this but I have been looking into ways we might do it. There are also a lot of other issues like restricting equipment though. It's much more complicated than it appears on surface.
Fair enough, though not everyone who fires off a complaint to feedback refers to the Ally LB, in my experience.
Good debate. I see tk still good with words ️ LB / GH is the way forward, if you can't do it you won't win as these guys quite rightly say the armoury is quite simply un balanced if u match LB/GH with a mid range similar sized CS none LB / GH then the LB will plunder and squash. No ifs no buts it's FACT! Only way forward in my opinion / experience is to tighten hit ranges to think a LB and unranked player can both hit an overall player ranked 1900 is silly. The player ranked 1900 clearly unable to touch LB successfully - and whilst he can hit unranked player makes no plunder. Now if that one player is now several in one roster you have problems - solution - change build or find somewhere else to war...... Neither are any good if you are LOYAL or actually play the game in the way it was designed to be played ie) make gold and grow etc etc.....
Hiney and Khay, Kisses to you both! Kaw Gods, Please give up on the banner project and not only hear your paying customers, but do something. I am quite tired of ummm gardening... Maybe you should only listen to the folks who regard the ally LB as the "real" LB.
I think that's part of my point, we have a lot of paying customer who play the game differently and they want different things. So we try to balance not only what people say they want, but we look at data that shows what they do. We try to balance this with all the opinions people have. We do listen to our paying customers, and our non-paying customers and make the best decisions we can with all the information we have.
So ur last roster had 7 gh 1 ps (or most likely at time of war) and the rest over 15 mill cs att/hybrid builds ? Just because none were lb doesn't change the fact that that's the exact type of stacking we are talking about no mids in that clan at all in last war (I didn't go back further I can if u like) But it's the exact trickle down effect I was talking about u do that and match the clans u did pretty well out matching them in every way possible because the effect ur gh had on the match now I turn those clans either have to follow suit or quit with no way to win Roster u fought had 16 mids 4-15 mill cs players not exactly a far fight no matter their builds
Dear Kaw gods, No disrespect, but kingdoms at WAR is the name of your game. Once, long ago, didn't the devs lose to a select group of players in a beta test? It would be fun and dare say insightful to war against the great kaw creators. Just a thought. Back to my gardening.
I would like to post a response to the ones that are concerned about mid-sized builds being ineffective in EE wars. I am a mid-sized build. I am an attack heavy hybrid with decent SDT and ADT. I war with the OP's war clan, It Burns When I EE, and I have warred in season 2 and throughout the chaos wars in other clans. It was mentioned that mid builds are prime targets for gh and sh to ko quickly. To be honest, I am rarely taken out by gh or sh. Yes, they can hit me, but I am still able to do a lot of damage against the other team before I am forced to sko. Even coming out of KO and fighting from pin I am able to plunder targets quickly before sko'ing again. It was also mentioned that mid-sized builds cannot plunder effectively. You can look at the history for my war clan, I have been in the top 5 in plunder for every war that we have participated in. I have typically out-plundered a lot of our big attack builds and I am usually toward the top for ko's against the other clan also. Again, I typically fight from pin most of the war and I am still able to pull in significant plunder. I do not look at my build as a negative or as something that will hurt my team. It is not your build that makes you good in war... it is how you use it.
I'm in no way attacking u or ur clan for its tactics let's get that out the way now Only the validity of ur previous statements any clan that consistently wins in this format is stacking rosters in some sort of way or another to achieve favorable matches instead of trying for fair fights Now to cut u off from looking at my war history any one who knows me at all knows that K.o.S which I am the lead wc and war strategist for has continually beat it's head against a wall of gh for more wars then any in most clans have ever fought we have done ee since the very first beta and with high hopes and love of the idea behind the new system and continued no matter wat was thrown at us all the while avoiding gh altogether until we had to finally cave the last couple weeks of season 2 Just to find that when we didn't use gh we pretty much only matched gh/lb clans and then when we did break down we matched mostly clans with either little or no gh It feels so crappy to have to use them then to end up being that which u despise just to try to obtain anything close to a good hard fought war more then 1/10 sign ups Last couple weeks 3 matches I can remember were anything close to "fair" not to mention the increase in no matches for whatever reason as we have no explanation from the devs as to what we may be doing wrong if anything All anyone wants here is a good close match hard fought war we don't want to out roster someone or have no hope to win as the only two choices to war
KAW ADMIN since u here and answering questions a total noob one for you. Scout actions why allow use of spy attack pots when carrying out scout actions???
Sorry bud missed u but the one above u is over 15 mill cs as was all but those gh /ps and then u While most of the other clan was actually mid sized and much smaller then even u were/are If u can honestly tell me that those two rosters have any business matched together then I feel sorry for u when u screw up and start matching the other way and trust me it will happen
@ thanatos, To answer your question how I explain 'all those clans that manage to build a good roster' on page 4 : First off, there are a limited number of clans that can consistently pull off building a 'good' (stacked) roster. I can list maybe 7 right now. Some ideas on how those clans manage that - and in no way referencing to any clan in particular: 1 - alts. Since a GH or SoSH lvl 1 only takes a month or two to get war ready (its main purpose is to bring down cs) it is not that hard to get them. The more radical option is to drop build, which has also happened. 2 - sit out certain builds that want to do a war but don't 'fit' the good roster; with a large enough pool of people it is easy to pick. But the people sitting out could have been warring, increasing clan participation and improving matchups. 3 - recruit the right builds from other clans that just give up after being smashed by a stacked clan repeatedly. Not really good for clan loyalty.
@ kaw_admin it is nice to see you responding - like Hiney said, LB is always meant as ally LB. And since you ask for feedback, here goes: I'll use the following Chaos wars participants: - middle build: 17M cs attack build with 5T in allies and 320M in bfe, with 2M adt and 3M sdt; - SH: has 48 sos level 1 and 1 lvl 3 HF balanced attack building and 1.5M in SDT on HF (total 3M cs), with 2T in allies and 320M in bfe. - LB: is any LB you want in the top 100 ally LB, 22M cs and 320M in bfe. Here is what happens if we put a clan of 2 middle builds against a clan with 1 LB 1 SH. The cs would be 34M for the middle builds, and only 25M for team SH/LB. Bfe is equal, but bfa on team SH/LB is a lot bigger. They will get a match under the current system and the hit ratio will be 100%, because everyone can hit anyone on the opponent. What happens in war: the middle builds can hit the SH for 10M a hit. They will fail on the LBplayer. The LB player will win all attacks on the opponent middle builds for about 75M a hit. If the LB manages 10 attacks he makes 750M. If both middle builds manage 10 attacks they make 200M total. After an hour, the war is over with a huge win for the LB/SH team. As per OP's solution, the middle team should build a 'good' roster. So one of them should drop build and go SH, the other should spend lots of money to reach LB. Or they should recruit others and not war anymore. Both options I don't like much. What are the other solutions? 1. Tightening the dtw/dts range would solve # 1 - the SH cannot reach the middle anymore. It would also keep the LB that have more than 20 times the bfa of middle builds away from those middle builds (# 3). 2. Increasing the amount SH pay would solve # 2 - they become 'plunderable'. 3. Small roster sizes make it way too easy to field a team of only GH/SH. Increasing rosters therefore will lessen the problem but it is not a solution. Stacking is possible in any roster size. But, didnt devs already fixed the problem by decreasing plunder and hit range on GH? Simple answer, no. The GH and now the SH aren't primarily in wars because of their awesome plunder capabilities - they are simply there to bring down the average cs in the combination with the LB without leaking plunder. In the above example, the SH can make zero gold and the SH/LB combo will still have an easy win. So basically, the amount a GH/SH makes becomes almost irrelevant. The fact that they are 'unplunderable' by middle builds is the real problem which the current 'nerf' does nothing for. And, have you not already brought back 25 man rosters? As stated above, small rosters only increase the problem and bigger rosters somewhat decrease it. It is however, not a FIX to the underlying problem. Only a bit of an inconvenience for the LB/SH stacking clans. 2---------------- Next problem: if roster sizes are increased and wars are 2 hours, participation will decrease. Solution: make participating worth it more. GET THOSE WAR XSTALS OUT. Make wars pay out more gold, aqua, inferno, whatever. More clans means better matchups.