Re: Congratulations Empire Rising! You beat S26TR! Nobody said they where impossible. They've done maybe what? 7 wars. 7 wars doesn't define a clan as impossible to beat because they won all 7.
Re: Congratulations Empire Rising! You beat S26TR! Ummm read the other threads about this clan. Plenty of whining by moose and his followers . Look in war section with any thread about s29 pure spy clan
Re: Congratulations Empire Rising! You beat S26TR! Didn't rising hawks have a 120 something streak of wins?
Re: Congratulations Empire Rising! You beat S26TR! Bump.. Hoping the people in other s26 threads I bumped find their way here to continue good discussion on EE wars.
Re: Congratulations Empire Rising! You beat S26TR! Congrats Empire Rising, we had a very close war with -00- yesterday, the advantage wars do give a better chance of success against their set up.
Re: Congratulations Empire Rising! You beat S26TR! Congrats to ER still one if the best clans out there. What people hate pale rider is that in a skirmish war unless you are able to hit their lb players your sitting there twiddling your thumbs wasting your time showing up. Big deal if you can steal a few hundred k These wars normally are fast furious fun and attacking is all important and you get 30plus billion. With this set up its a few members vs their lb and everyone ends full troops bored out of their mind feeling they just wasted an hour of your lives. Who cares if you knock em out when you get sweet FA for it. It's back to old turtle wars. Boring as hell and nobody can really want that can they? Yes they can be beaten but its a suck ass way to war that kills the fun for most people involved. Ee was developed and supposed to eliminate dtw. Yet again players have manipulated the system ( badly set up ) to exploit a mech that turns these wars back to turtles. Hell maybe I should call myself Leonardo and paint myself green if I have to war them again. Or pull out my toe nails which would certainly require more effort and involvement. Actually I may do just that sounds like fun in comparison
Re: Congratulations Empire Rising! You beat S26TR! Empire the dark knight. I read what you just posted. I hear what you are saying. I'd like to point something out in response. I think using sports might be my best avenue to convey the point. Sports provide a game in which people try to achieve victory over an opponent. Usually based on a numeric scoring system. We are provided the basic rules of the game and it is each teams responsibility to formulate a strategy which they think will best help them obtain that victory. Take basketball for instance. You could formulate a strategy that focuses on an uptempo game and focuses on acquiring a high total of points (ex: 120 points per game, fast pace basketball, such as the 80's lakers) Fun and frenetic pace and lots of excitement. Or perhaps you could choose to slow things down, and play a defensive minded game, to slow the pace down. Maybe run half court offense, and utilize the whole shot clock. And on defense. Slow things down as much as possible. (Example: San Antonio spurs in late 90s and early 2000's.) limit the opponents scoring opportunities as much as possible. Some hated watching this kinda basketball cuz they thought it was boring. What's the point? The point is, just because you don't like a particular type if system war, and if doesn't fit into your preference of how a game/war should be fought, doesn't mean that strategy is wrong. It just means it doesn't suit your preference. Just like high plunder wars might not suit their preference. So IMO the issue isn't whether it's illegal or not. Because it really isn't. So let's just dismiss the thought on changing any rules. Because #1,if they aren't breaking any rules, (which they aren't) And #2 if your opinion/preference isn't what determines what is legal or not (which it doesn't, because no one person can represent the entire communities opinion) Then theirs no grounds to change anything. And id like to remind you, that the reason 90% of your smaller players can't hit the lb players at all, is because of the dtw/dts people asked for, as a result of complaints about small gh ability to hit bigger players. Perhaps the real issue is "why do you want to control how your enemy chooses to war in a war game? (When they haven't broken any rules) Is it Just because they are choosing a strategy that doesn't suit your preferences? Would you like to control what strategy your enemy chooses to employ? (Which doesn't seem very challenging) Or perhaps you would you like to allow freedom of choice on what people use as their strategy. And perhaps be challenged and stimulated to find solutions to a variety of different strategies you might encounter. As Long as the basic set of rules afford everyone the same equal opportunity, then their is nothing unfair or illegal about what they are doing. My final point being, "You, nor moose, nor anybody else is to determine what the "right way to have EE wars is". They've given us a set of rules that allow for a fair and equal stage for participation. Every time a strategy comes up, that threatens to keep un-evolving clans from obtaining their goal of victory, are the Devs going to listen to only their complaints, and incorporate new rules that they they think will help make the wars more fair and just and right? (Example: dtw/dtw cuz of guilds.) Where has the gotten you? Here, cuz you can't hit LB. And now some of the same people that asked for that rule are complaining because of the consequences of that rule. Does anybody see a problem here? P.S. As for your being stuck with full troops. Thats a self perpetuated myth. Its only because you choose not to use your troops. Why? Idk. Ask yourself. But you can attack pure spies. Just be open minded enough to imagine avenues in how, you can. And if you run into a roadblock in your thought process, ask yourself, "why can't I employ that strategy?" "Is their a rule in kaw that prohibits me from doing it." Hmmmmm
Re: Congratulations Empire Rising! You beat S26TR! Didn't have time to proofread that.sorry if it's rough reading lol. And if I left anything out, address it and I will respond.
Re: Congratulations Empire Rising! You beat S26TR! Nice post And hmm ok opening them up Ie strip or volley. Hidden allies before match up for the ones in hit range with them. I would gladly open them up next war round. I'm sure many have noted their allies ( those few they have since ) if bit I hope many do. Guild hansels and dtw that's the lamest pos system that was ever put in place to correct an exploit that could of been easily killed with a minimum value applied in ee wars. Sometimes what people want and what people ask for are two different things and what kaw gave us was a solution no one actually wanted or needed. A simple ko bonus gold amount for a ko would eliminate a lot of the problems warring them Now as stripping wasn't an option that war and they don't attack or steal and don't have gold out that means basically they are dtw and not much will change that. Tactics wc used almost won the war. Bad luck it was lost in a close war and either way I'd be just as furious. Towers were changed because of this type of exploit clans like this forming will cause other changes IMO A clan where 90% are dtw in a skirmish ? That is clearly against the spirit of ee wars something I very much doubt devs will ignore. Seriously who would want a war game where you cannot attack? Exploit for rancor. Totally they earnt so little mith overall with so few actions. Never have I seen a war before with so few actions and so little plunder since the start of ee wars. Truly if that's the future of ee it's pathetic and I'm done with it. Win or lose the boredom isn't worth it. As for tempo as a pushed for in season 1 run up it would of been nicer to see regen times played with giving people more troops to play with in a skirmish war enabling more profit and a bigger incentive to keep people playing. Why do I want to control opponents tactics. For the most part I don't I applaud the effort of them even if it damages ee wars. But it will damage ee wars which I condemn. Tactics do what you will and good luck but the base board needs to be remotely even in a multiplayer game. I can also pretty much assure this type of clan would not exist outside of rancor due to the poor mith rewards of the majority and they would never gain out of it. Every sport evolves Rules always need to be updated to counter development of participants and the balance of entertainment and value must be maintained or the sport as a source of entertainment will die. Personally I don't speak for the kaw community, I speak for myself and what I believe is in the best interest of the games future My final point Sorry to er for waffling on so long on your thread it was a well deserved win and I am glad you showed everyone it can be done and I hope many follow that example including myself.
Re: Congratulations Empire Rising! You beat S26TR! It's kind of ironic really. EE wars are heavily regulated in some areas, but allow an absurd amount of abuse in others. War time and duration regulated Dtw regulated Xstals regulated Equipment locked Ridiculous rosters however are the order of the day. 2-3 lb and the rest pissy GH. Now LB and ps. To have a hope of winning, we seem to need to make massively unbalanced clans or assemble teams with grossly overweight BFE. Little wonder that support for EE wanes. Truly effective EE will only occur when general KaW in game mechanics are left at the door. Then, real strategy, tactics and team unity will decide winners and losers, as opposed to merely assembling a skewed team to take advantage of an in game mech. None of this will happen however. Why? I'm convinced that the current development team doesn't understand the fundamentals of their own code. As I've said before, when was the last time we truly got a meaningful change or addition to this game? A couple of years at least by my math. Think about it. When they munted the invincible tower build, they didn't change the mech, they just slid the scale of tower requirement to render the build useless. They didn't address the GH issue at all. Just turned on an existing DTW, that if anything, made things worse. New EB's are just an extension of a two year old framework. Devs are a joke. The game will continue its race to the bottom, slowed ever so slightly by regular double/triple gold injections.
Re: Congratulations Empire Rising! You beat S26TR! I too as well applaud ER for their win. They are 1-1 verses s26 Giskard might have brought up a more important topic. But their could be an ever more important topic than Giskard that trumps all. The true exploit on kaw
Re: Congratulations Empire Rising! You beat S26TR! Interesting side note. Close to half of LR had 10 successful actions or less. Excellent that they could rise above the latest exploit. But seriously what's the point? 1 action every 6 minutes. Sounds like fun. Dear oh dear.
Re: Congratulations Empire Rising! You beat S26TR! Emp dark, first off, I'd like to thank you for the thoughtful discussion without The unnecessary banter. I understand your frustration with the 90% roster being dtw because you can't attack a ps with no gold out. Defense and allowing the least amount of plunder targets is the thought process that went behind the ps strategy. My question to you is, Are you suggesting that this is an exploit in the game that kaw should be rid of? Or are you frustrated with its role in EE wars? Because let's be clear... A clan using pure spies gives you know plunder advantage. In fact it puts you at a disadvantage, if the other clan uses all possible tactics. Ps can never attack for gold because the void of troops. Even if circumstances might occasionally dictate that you can't attack a ps, you still have the capability of manipulating that too happen in several different avenues. Something that is not possible (in the realm of attack) for pure spies. And whether people like it or not, pure spy and hansel, no gold out effect has always existed. One solution to the hansel no gold out effect was the creation of hybrid made hansel killers. An ingenious idea that came about because people went through the efforts to test game mechs and find a solution to what seemed an exploit with no flaw. I guess I'm defending the role of pure spy in EE wars, because in a plunder war (which is what EE is) a pure spy is at no advantage in regards to obtaining more gold as opposed to a different build. I propose that every build has its role in EE wars. It's what creates diversity and causes the gamer who wants challenge to use their brain to come up with new solutions to ever changing strategies created by the community. There will always be situations that seem unfair at first, but those that are persistent will find ways to overcome. As ER has already done. I am for pure spy. It brings an interesting dynamic to EE wars and requires people to use their brains. And btw. Their are strategies for pure spy that still haven't been used. More, than I've even let on to friends. Many more. But if I said them, it would be like giving a cheat book, and where's the fun in that. But as far as countering this strategy, read the threads concerning s26. A couple ideas that actually work, have been proposed, but I'm not sure if exercised yet. And keep conversing with peeps. To me the real fun and spirit of kaw is playing a game that stimulates your mind to come up with new and ever evolving strategies all the time. Once again, thank you for the stimulating conversation.
Re: Congratulations Empire Rising! You beat S26TR! Pale. I hear what you're saying. Clearly there is no denying that any build can be countered. Counter strategy, turn your brain on etc etc. Ironically, that's what all the tower builds we're saying way back... But more to he point. Half a clan has 10 successful actions or less in a 1 hour war. Quite simply, that's not what EE should be about. If this is the level of stimulation we can expect from EE moving forward, might as well go read Leviticus or something. At any rate, EE participation will plummet (beyond already terrible levels). That's no good for anyone. Maybe all the guild hansels and pure spies should be placed in their own 'elite' EE arena. You champions can all strategise and think deep thoughts. The remainder of all of us dumb, non thinking, lack lustre players can beat up on each other with more than 10 actions an hour...
Re: Congratulations Empire Rising! You beat S26TR! Sorry I had left the thread but simply put As a build I fully support pure spies. No better way to annoy the heck out of people in normal kaw. However for the sake of ee wars and it there that there presence will be detrimental to the game then no they should not have the same mechanic applied. Yes try are at a plunder disadvantage too as they refuse to earn. The point is except for lb fighting in ee wars with pure spy clans every one else without exception might as well go put a movie on and skim steals A war with no incoming except a few scouts and failed assa is boring seriously I have never ever been in a war with so few actions even in the days of being say on in season 1 when that happened we had more actions. War where you cannot attack your opponent and they refuse to attack you. What is the point ? Seriously there isn't one Is the build an exploit? No Is the formation of an abnormal clan for the purpose of farming rancor exploitive. Yes. Any clan that basically has 90% of its roster sit back and do nothing is exploitive and messed up. For a skirmish ee war where people essentially pay for the experience and fun plus put hours of effort in its not an acceptable scenario. As giskard rightly points out. It will be one more nail in the coffin for this game. The basic argument and idea behind ee wars always was to open up gameplay and get rid of dtw putting action back into wars. A trend to take that away will kill ee seasons and involvement for many. How to limit/ remove it. Remove dtw in wars ( as was the original promise ) Minimum attack value ( kills gh exploit but not build ) Add a gold amount to ko's (even if they have earnt no plunder so there is no incentive not to earn. ) Enter a war fight it. Or don't bother. If we cannot fight in wars I for one am out as there is no thrill or fun in dtw And dtw out of ee personally bugs me as it removes some of the fun of pinning someone and I'd love to ko someone out of ee wars as well as in them
Re: Congratulations Empire Rising! You beat S26TR! Giskard, please show me where it is written '"quite simply " what these EE wars are supposed to be about. And I think your referring to limited successful "attack" actions yes? Not. All actions. If that's the case, then I agree, and that's the exact purpose of it. Just because it stifles a clan who is biased toward using heavy attack builds, with aggressive plunder motive, does not mean its wrong and bad for the game. It just means it's bad for people who insist on using a EE roster that is heavily laden with attack builds. Once again , until you can show me where there's a visible issue being violated that's written by kaw, I'll continue to consider the issue as a conflict of everyone's different preference. And my preference is that I like pure spy and the dynamics it brings in EE wars.
Re: Congratulations Empire Rising! You beat S26TR! Well said Dark. He's addressing the issues. At the the end of the day, do we want a good EE experience or hit some moral high ground arguing whether something is strategic or an exploit? Think about it. Let's hope the devs do too.
Re: Congratulations Empire Rising! You beat S26TR! Sorry emp. I guess I just look at EE wars sorta like football. Not everyone needs to score a touchdown. Or be the quarterback that threw the winning pass. As a pure spy, some have said we are relegated to being piñatas, which couldn't be further from the truth. An offensive lineman might not ever gain a single yard, or score a single touchdown in a game, but that does not diminish the importance of his role in the team. Perhaps it's a difference in perspectives. But I see a lot of difference, uses for pure soy in EE wars that require strategy and well thought out teamwork and planning. As far as being an opponent of this strategy, all I will say is their are many strategies that aren't even being thought of. Perhaps others out there are working away at it. I hope so. But their are ways to manipulate the circumstances to where you can catch pure spies. You don't have to let them keep your troops locked down in futility. I can think of several strategies myself. A couple That I know will work cuz I've been at the wrong end of them as a pure spy in EE. lol I'm sure there are many more thoughts out there.