Ever thought of sums and averies? Havok I have 22sums n 2 averies wutchu think? imma put more averies though
Ok I don't mind using atk pots i like the plunder im getting too at the moment. Max spy I get 11.1 at full now i just gotta test it in war
I feel there r gonna be some new moderators comming and they r havoc and igiggle good job helping out .
okay, I'm back with some stuff guys! Hav's post is extreamly detailed-oriented already, so i'm going to make some extream comparisions here to enlarge the margin. Lets say there are 5 different layouts here 1. 24 subs 2. 24 avs 3. 24 circles 4. 20 of any buildings above + 4 guilds 5. 19 of any buildings above + 1 aviary + 4 guilds as we all know that A.aviary porvides 2100 troops and better stats but low regen like 10 min if troops are 0. (correct me if i'm wrong). B.circle provides better def and 5% more plunder bonus but only if u choose to hit player stronger than u. C. sub is same old same old, higt attk, low def, but give u the ability to fight away from getting pinned. D. guild provides better plunder but just slightly. SO, category 1: 24 subs, attk 518,400 def 345,600 = 864,000 category 2: 24 aviaries, attk 473,760 def 473,760 = 947,520 category 3: 24 circles, attk 393,600 def 518,400 = 912,000 based on no reset. Generally speaking, aviary gives u the best combined stats in this theoretcal comparision. Let's take aviary as a base line, which means, category 1 offers 9.4% more attk and 27% less def. the difference value is -17.6% category 3 offers 16.9% less attk and 9.4% more def. the difference value is -7.5% which proves aviary gives u the best stats overall theoretically. Since I am new to this game, my point of view after above will need to be corrected if i am biased. During the war, u need to breach through other ppl's defense if u attack. Which means u have to lean to attk. The degree of the lean depends on how do u feel about the war or this game. Also, u need some defense as well, since if u get attked alot there is no place to fight back. I assume, (corret me if i'm wrong) pure subs will need massive allies to compensate deffense. pure circles will need massive allies to compensate attack. pure aviaries will need moderate allies to compensate both. the compensate rate between pure subs and pure circles compared with pure aviaries is different. So, pure sub is the most heavily allies dependent. If we look at the allies market, it seems like inactives have more deffense stats and actives have more attack stats but not all the time. Every allies you hire always have attk and def stats. It's just the matter of which one is more or less. I think hiring allies who have more def stats is easier and they won't get hired away as easily as high attk allies. If my thinking is correct, then, pure aviaries will be easier to hire desirable allies becasue aviary's base line is even, and we just need balance the allies pool to make attk better than def. About category 4 and 5, I've got questions: 1. From LC to BC, it's desirable to have some guilds, but how many guilds can fulfill the purpose of having them? 2. The reason I only have 1 aviary in category 5 is that I want to take the advantage of 26 hits. would this layout will suffer during the war since the atk stats is low if i intend to use it to go through from LC to BC? I've also got questions after re-reading Hav0c's post: 3.does it mean pure circles will be less targeted since pure subs are the prime targets during the war? 4. Pure circles offer the lowest attk stats. does it mean i need invest more $$ into allies to reach the same level of pure aviaries in theory? 5. May anyone be kind enough to point out the "each soldier bonuses" for tier 3 building so that I can calculate the max allies hiring cost for each tier 3 level 3 building? (so far i only know for each level 3 forge u need 45mil allies plunder bonus to reach the 80% plunder earn if u attack.) Thanks again for HAV0C's great work and others as well. Cheers!
1. For people that just start playing I always suggest 3 or 4 guilds then upgrade them as necessary. Until you LC I recommend keeping them at level 3. In the process of going from LC to BC the guilds will be the last things to convert. If you want to keep them this would be the time to upgrade them to level 4. 2. It is very true the last two hits will be extreme weak because at this point the other buildings have ran out of troops. Most of the time your not going to be in a war and maybe hitting an OSF. With an OSF it doesn't matter how weak the hit is, you will always be successful at getting a win, except with that random 1% fail attack. In a war most likely everyone will be using attack and defense pots, so all pots will cancel each others pots and might fail on the last two attacks. 3. Wars are a plunder contest, who ever gets the most plunder wins. Your objective is to have successful attacks while using the least amount of troops. As stated above everyone will be using pots and therefore all pots will be canceled out, it's like you didn't use any and they didn't use any. Your build will be the biggest factor with ally bonus as a close second. Now with this in mind who are you going to hit, the person showing 516,400 defense bonus stats or the one showing 345,600 defense bonus stats. You hit the 500K you might win but use up a lot of troops so you'll have less hits per hour. With the 300K your most likely to get a win and use up less troops and get in more hits per hour. In short, yes pure sub builds are hit less. 4. You will find all the stats you requested on this link except the subs. For subs tear 3 level 3 is 540 attack and 360 defense. Note: All stats are per troop. How building are benchmarked: You want to know the effectiveness of your raw power with respect to attack and defense, calculate this ratio. Let: TBE = Troop Build Effectiveness A = Your attack bonus to allies B = Your defense bonus to allies C = The maximum possible attack bonus to allies (518,400) D = The maximum possible defense to allies (518,400) TBE = (AB) / (CD) Or TBE = (AB) / 518,400^2 This number will tell you how well your troop build will do in war. It does not take into account pots, ally bonus, or spies. All it says is the troop effectiveness at getting successful hits and blocking attacks. It does help explain why pure sub builds are attacked a lot and pure circles have a difficult time getting hits in. The number has a maximum value of 83% from a pure aviary build, hence why pure aviary is the best troop build.
Way to go guys this is a great thread to reference to. Question: so all aviaries except 1 lv 4guild is a good choice in the long run for wars? Btw I'm still kinda new
Thank you, I'm glad you enjoy the posts so far. If it wasn't for the great questions this thread wouldn't exist. I really need to link to a comp to edit those earlier posts lol.. For your question having one guild will be difficult to use in a war. It's hard to find targets with that low of spy defense. Well what about using attack pots? Remember everyone will have hundreds if not thousands of both troop and spy defense pots so any spy pots will be nullified. You'll have to use at lest two guilds if not three to make use of spies in wars. Although do no build any more than 12. Why 12? There is a way to modify the TBE equation to find the overall build effectiveness. Let: OBE = Overall Build Effectiveness A = Your attack bonus to allies B = Your defense bonus to allies C = Your spy attack to allies D = Your spy defense to allies OBE = (ABCD) / (518,400^2 * 324,000^2) The OBE has a maximum value at 52.8% which corresponds to 12 aviaries and 12 guilds. This build has stats of 236,880 attack/defense and 162K spy attack/defense. In a one-on-one situation this is a fantastic build. Any pure troop build, even one with a few guilds will have trouble against it because of the large spy stats. But remember KaW isn't a one-on-one game and it's cheaper to use defense pots than attack pots, and you'll be using a lot of attack pots. The price of attack pots as compared to the net plunder received don't make this a money making build. With that I still support the sub/aviary build. But if your playing style requires guilds it wouldn't hurt to add a few in. Just don't cannibalize your troop build to where your always using pots.
About the 5% per circle thing. Every building contributes a specific amount of gold to the net plunder, except for towers because they don't provide troops, and it is the circles contribution to the net plunder that was raised by 5%, not the net plunder.
i am not understanding circles. do you get a 5% increase in plunder for EACH circle? or do you only get 5% no matter how many?
Let's say that Before the update a sub gave X amout of plunder and a circle gave Y amount of plunder. After the update a sub gives X amount of plunder and a circle now gives 1.05Y amount of plunder. So if your build is 23 subs and 1 circle your plunder will be 23X + 1.05Y or if your build has 12 subs and 12 circles your plunder will be 12X + 1.05*12Y.
Thx hav0c for the compturized edit! I'm starting to see this game on numbers now and I'm wondering what I can find out! As usual, questions follow: 1. Any thoughts about aviaries and circles mixed builds? 2. Money making point of view, let's say u wanna 4 guilds and u happen to have an osf. Whats the best mix ratio to mix circles and aviaries? 3. So far, I won't mix subs and circles coz they canceled each other out and u won't have enough attk stats to hit stonger ppl to gain 5% extra plunders bonus. 4. I do see some ppl play "getting pinned", which means u can't do Anthony due to "too weak to attk". How are they doing this? Thanks every one, especially for this thread, answer provider and question makers!:-D Cheers!
Plus one thing, I saw osf sometimes say that they are open and closed, how do they control it? Because i'm thinking if u matain the troops or spies under 80% manually, that's just too much work. Please enlighten me! Appreciated!
Here is a table of all combinations of 24 troop buildings of the circle & aviary combination. From rows 1 to 9 you'll have a difficult time hitting targets, from 10 to 15 you'll be able to hold your own, and from 16 to 25 you'll do good and maybe able to hit high priority targets. Recall one of the most popular builds are pure subs, with the circle and aviary build you'll be able to give them a good beat down but any other build type will be a challenge. If your looking for a money making build you'll want the Hansel build. 1 troop building with 23 guilds. With this build your troops are only good for hitting OSF and you'll be using your spies for your opponents. Your plunder will be garbage because the low troop count but your ally plunder will be unaffected and spies do make more money per steel than plunder. When I was Hansel build I was getting 8M to 9M average per steel and about 9M in ally plunder from OSF. With my current build I'm getting 12M on average per hit. Despite having extremely high spy stats, you will be hit a lot from having extremely low troop stats. dtw = Defender To Weak Regarding dtw, each build has it's own set of special cases: Pure Attack: If troops are above 20% and has cash out you can steel them forever until cash runs out at which point dtw. When troop level is below 20% they'll be invulnerable to attacks from spies and troops. Mixed Build: If troops are above 20% and no cash is out, you can steel until spies are below 20% at which point dtw. If troops are above 20% and there is cash out you can steel forever even if spies are at zero level. If troops are below 20% they will only be dtw by troop attack and can be stolen from until spies are below 20%. Pure Spy: If there is cash out they can be attacked forever until cash runs out at which point dtw. They can be stolen from with or with out cash out until spies are below 20% at which point dtw. In wars some people fight from the self pin position. They'll attack before troop or spy levels reach 20% to keep themselves dtw. Pretty much you can't attack them but they can attack you. When people are pure spy and say open, that means are allowing people to attack them without retaliation. Just as long as their spy level is above 20% and they have some amount of cash out they can be attacked. Closed means they are not allowing people to hit them and will retaliate when attacked.