Are Rewards REALLY better?

Discussion in 'Strategy' started by ___SkittIes-__-0v3rLoAD___, Mar 29, 2018.

  1. Charms and Rewards - For Better or Worse?


    With the introduction of charms and rewards still being semi-new, people in KaW, understandably, are still figuring out the effects of what it is they've been trading. Lately, there's been lots of discussion regarding charms "not working", and people are flocking to rewards as the alternative. But the question remains, if charms are ineffective, how do we know that rewards work? What is the actual difference? Are charms actually ineffective??

    To get to the bottom of this, I decided to do a couple of tests, and find out the exact truth with evidence to back my theories, rather than simply throwing blind rumors and myths out there (if anyone is able to tell me how I can add pictures to forums, I've got a bunch waiting). What I did, was I got two of my smallest accounts, both similar sizes, under 20mil cs hybrids with no towers, with one being that bit bigger than the other, and the smaller one being the "experiment account", used to do a series of charm/reward transfers between itself, and one of my main accounts.

    Test One. The Standard hit/defend test

    First, I used my smaller account (with no pots, charms, bfe, furniture, mith, or rewards) to attack the slightly larger account, and also take turns defending against it. both accounts struggled hitting eachover, losing lots of troops/spies, with a bit below 50/50 success rate for the smaller account.

    Then, I sent 1.43bil in charms to my smaller account, and tried again. Similar results, barely any difference whatsoever.

    Finally, I sent the charms back to my main, and tried again, but this time, with 1.2bil in rewards, hoping for more success. Unfortunately, the rewards turned out to be just as useless, despite, in mathematical equations, adding up to be more than enough to hit the other account easily.

    Rather than quitting there, I decided to push on, thoughts popping in my head like "Well that can't be it, I wonder if rewards and charms work together, when in plentiful supply..."

    Thus I prompted further. I decided I would double the cs on the smallest account in both rewards and charms, adding up a bit over 2.6bill cs now on my alt, which by all means, should've been enough to get through easily, every single time.

    At last, I managed to get through 3 attacks in a row, with a couple fail steals, but nevertheless, it was slightly more succesful than having no rewards or charms at all. That being said, I lost 9% troops per attack, and significant amounts of spies as well.

    Test Two. The Search for Glitches

    When I first found out about rewards supposedly being more powerful than charms, I tried to find out why, and what makes something thats tradable so "powerful", as everyone, including myself, seemed to believe. That is when I happened to see a seeming lack of stat reduction after a making a 350mil trade. Despite selling my charms for 2x, there appeared to be merely a change in the spread of my bonus stats, rather than my stats actually going down after selling for half the cs...

    Now it could just be my bad maths, given I was half asleep at the time, or the devs may have patched this, but during my recent tests, I found the exchange and trading between charms and rewards to now contain no "glitches" and deliver the perfect amount of bonus stats, thus disproving my theory that you could exchange charms for rewards without an actual reduction in stats, and then, of course, if on alts, be able to move those "sold" charms back on top, thus giving strong, compact stats.

    My Conclusion

    In conclusion, I have discovered that both charms and rewards are pretty darn useless, when you need a good few billion to see even the smallest bit of change, and the notorious war builds like hippy and instinct, only have significant power from rewards due to the fact that they have absolutely colossal amounts of them. That being said, if you can get colossal amounts of them (as in a minimum of maybe 25 to 30bil), then of course, they can help.

    My theory is that somewhere between 500m and 1bil in charms/rewards, could equate to perhaps 1mil in actual beneficial stats.

    As always, I hope you enjoyed my thread, and I look forward to any comments, questions, and/or contradicting theories regarding this matter :) Yours, Skittles/AccidentalFarming
     
  2. Here's why rewards dont have any effect for you once you have traded them to an account you have to wait 10-15 minutes for them to take effect. Trade them to your test account wait a little and try again.

    And yes to answer the question rewards are better 100% of their stats work where as equipment charms have no effect whatsoever.
     
  3. Let's be clear. Charms are ineffective against epic battles. They seem to work everywhere else. I'm a PvP grinder, my build is literally made to maximize war gains but minimalize EB gains. I'm the opposite of an EB Fairy (Nothing against EB grinders, facts are just that) so to me that little glitch doesn't matter.

    I'm sorry to say this but this is an EB Fairy only problem. Since everything works just fine in PvP I still collect both Charms & Rewards in excess.
     
  4. This isn't true equipment charms work for absolutely nothing.
     
  5. 215B charms here. (Excluding rewards)

    Do charms work? PvP, yes. PvE, I don't see a significant change to my hit damage range. So I'm quite convinced that EB damage from charms/rewards might be capped.

    I didn't take anyone's word for it, I had over 30 testcases and noted my results in an excel sheet. I accounted for PPs/Achievement bonuses/Clan bonuses on attack/defence at PvP and PvE with charms and with rewards separately.
    Edit: Testing a few more things, will reflect updates here shortly.
     
  6. That sounds quite interesting, please do share, I will follow and pm you
     
  7. Well I just won on you so I guess that counts PvP out.
     
  8. Grizzy, please back your statements with what it is thats made you believe this theory, in order to avoid "it is, no it isnt" type arguments, and encourage well researched discussion
     
  9. This is exactly what I'm talking about, people run a few attacks(single attack in this case) and are convinced that charms don't work. You don't know my PP %, or even my defence from charms. I'll drop my attack building, run a FB twice or thrice. Note your TL % every time for every attack. You'll see the difference.
     
  10. I have done heaps of testing with multiple charms please just test rewards properly like I said and do the same with equipment charms I have no reason to chat out of my ass on this subject. I want it fixed and the only way it might get fixed and the devs finally listen is if heaps of people message them about it.
     
  11. I don't want to fb you I'm not like that but I did get overwhelming I can test more if you let me like I said on your wall I might lose when I get lower troops because you have a few rewards.
     
  12. But will they answer our questions??
     
  13. If they will .. you are lucky.. so goodluck lol
     
  14. Fix it then devs
     
  15. The idea of this sounds a bit ludicrous to me. Mathematically, how equipment stats are included into our attacks is a very simple equation.

    All equipment has ever been has been raw stats. Aka our "Cs" multiplied by 50.

    Both charms and rewards are added in with your equipment stats. Which can be found at


    In the event of hitting another player,

    Our raw build stats(visible at the top of your own profile)

    Are multiplied by any Percentage equip/Achievements/Clan Achievements/Perm Items that the player might own.



    So for me.
    A:497,015,625 •.34=173,955,469
    AD:666,561,168•.2925=194,969,141
    SA:16,438,713,000•.345=5,671,355,985
    SD:17,664,409,113•.2925=5,166,839,665
    *please note that these numbers change based off your troop and spies(except defense from towers)

    Then you simple add all the numbers
    Build BFA Percent BFE/Charms

    To show a demonstration here is my BFA:
    A:304,358,508
    AD:263,882,592
    SA:94,318,860
    SD:98,258,812



    So...
    A=497,015,625 304,358,508 173,955,469 2,888,058,358=3,863,387,960

    AD=666,561,168 263,882,592 194,969,141 1,906,805,187=3,032,218,088

    SA=16,438,713,000 94,318,860 5,671,355,985 3,551,098,311=25,755,486,156

    SD=17,664,409,113 98,258,812 2,018,791,610 5,166,839,665=24,948,299,200

    To turn that into a smaller number you are far more used to working with, the equivalence to a CS multiply it by .02


    A=3,863,387,960•.02=77,267,759
    AD=3,032,218,088•.02=60,644,361
    SA=25,755,486,156•.02=515,109,723
    SD=24,948,299,200•.02=498,965,984

    That is my true damage, and yes, I did take the long way to calculate it. Basically what I'm trying to say is that devs already added charms and rewards into the equipment/Achievement section of your profile.

    These numbers in your profile are most likely the result of an echo command utilizing PHP to disclose the variables that are added into this equation.

    Essentially, both Charms and Rewards are added to the same number in this equation, so they must be intended to have equal value to equipment.

    I'd also like to note the impact that Percent items had on my stats were extremely heavy and I'm only 700m cs. Most of the issues people are encountering could easily be explained by the Percent items the opponent owns, along with the difference in your Percent when hitting them.

    A difference of even 5% in bonus items on a BC could be equal to 10b charms.

    I hope this helps your understanding of how charms and rewards are calculated.
    Have a nice day:)

    [​IMG]
     
  16. That's all good elementary school maths, but the issue is much simpler:
    Equipment charms dont work. They just dont. Zero effect." style="max-width: 100%;" />" style="max-width: 100%;" />" style="max-width: 100%;" />" style="max-width: 100%;" />