Apple VS FBI

Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by Moose2, Feb 18, 2016.

  1. And back to your with Your DFU. That's not even close to the only way to break through iDevice password lock. I've gotten through a iPad mini 4 I think when it had activation lock active. (Where the previous owner has FindMyIphone on and it's supposed to completely lock down iDevice). I've broken through that and accessed files, I've broken through one of my jail broken iPhones numerous times just for shiz and giggles. And broken through mine, and other stolen iPhones that are not jailbroken just to see all the different ways it's possible. And trust me when I say, there are many more than DFU mode. I wouldn't be resetting the device anyways, so DFU is useless in most ways to me.
     
  2. In civil matters dead people still have privacy rights (their estates do anyways) ...ie: medical records and whatnot

    when it comes to "criminal" investigations it's murky & there's not enough precedent to make a legal argument for it in a court of law either way
     
  3. If Apple caves or loses its case, I'm going to seriously consider giving up my cell phone.

    When I think about how much of my life is in this thing, knowing that the government can remotely crack into it at any time really creeps me out.

    I mean, do you ever wonder what the people doing the searching are thinking while they browse through your most intimate life details?

    I picture a hipster dude in his mid-20s sitting at a computer with my phone data pulled up just scrolling while sipping a non-dairy soy mocha macchiato latte. I can imagine his thoughts "oh, he subscribes to the New York Times but he's pro-gun. He must be a terrorist." Or "damn his girlfriend has a nice ass." Or "hey, this is a nice picture of his male junk." Or "geez why is this guy playing MMORPGs all the time and why are his emails always so sentimental? He must be psychologically unstable." "Let's look at his list of friends - oh, here's one who went to Syria last month. He must be a terrorist." "Why does he have 5 bank accounts? He must be funding terrorists."

    These are the people who get to snoop through all your most private stuff and make a decision as to whether you belong on the no fly list or whether you should be investigated as a suspect.

    Imagine the type of person who would go to school and get a job so he can snoop through anyone's private pictures, emails and text messages. What kind of person has a career goal of spying on people? Think about what their true motivations are. It's the power, not service to country. If he wanted to serve his country, he would have done what I did and joined the military. Nobody gets to question those guys. And that's the guy who makes the call about your freedom. He is literally Edward Snowden before he had a sudden attack of conscience. There are thousands of other Edward Snowdens still at NSA, FBI and CIA who are perfectly happy snooping through your most intimate details. Is that really the guy you FBI supporters want making that call? You don't see anything wrong with that? You don't see anything wrong with not being able to question that?
     

  4. Why is this such a surprise to everyone/anyone? We've been warned for years and years and years about this type of thing happening and basically everyone ignores it.

    ....read what Frederich Nietze wrote about the nature of man and the associations/institutions created by man.
     
  5. Well I don't think Apple should have to write the program. John Mcafee has offered to hack into the phone for the government so that Apple wouldn't have to give the fbi the key to open any Idevice. I think this isn't just about the privacy of the owner of the phone but it's the point that if they can do it to that phone they can do it to any phone no matter what the circumstances.
     
  6. Cheese you really thing that if Apple is winning or losing this case will change anything for you? You think that hipster from NSA, FBI, CIA, FSB, MI6, etc. can't access your data? With that particular phone things are complicated because it's locked. But your phone is up and running therefore that hipster's possibilities are countless. I don't have a problem with that...I consider myself a nobody and therefore the chance to have a hipster peeking on my phone are 1/1000000000. But if you really care about your privacy all you can do is to take care at what do you keep on your phone/PC or stop using them.
     
  7. But don't you realize that what you suggest is a de-facto infringement on freedom of speech?

    It actually goes even further than that. It's censorship on freedom of thought. You can't even write down your thoughts in your phone without wondering who might read it some day.

    Don't you ever have evil thoughts? I like to write down my evil thoughts sometimes. That doesn't mean I intend to act on them but I do like to write my thoughts down sometimes. Or are you of pure mind?
     
  8. @todd - interesting dude and philosophy. I love that kind of stuff!
     
  9. icloud lock as a bypass online that's a server side lock also not a internal device lock like the lock on the device in question.
     
  10. Of course I have evil toughts Cheese. But I keep them as toughts only =) I don't write them down.
     
  11. And again...i don't care that much about privacy. I didn't encrypted my phone even if I could do it (Yes, Todd...out of the box iPhone are more secure than an Android phones. On Android encryption is not default). I never set unlock codes on my phones neither. If I lose or i have my phone stolen the one who find/steal my phone could just see some photos. I don't care. The only think I avoid doing on my phone is internet banking.
     
  12. I like to write my evil thoughts down. Always have. It's not against the law for me to write about murdering my neighbor. Now if I write that down on paper notebook somewhere, nothing will ever come of it because I'm not actually going to murder my neighbor.

    When I got a cell phone with a notes app, I started writing them there. It's therapeutic for me. If I can vent my thoughts safely where no one will ever read them, then I get some relief by letting go of some anger.

    Now I have to watch what I write down too because I might get investigated?

    Now you just took away my safe place to vent my anger and frustration with the world. Now what am I supposed to do? Keep it bottled up? What if I wanna text my buddy about how I'm so mad at my boss that I wanna cut his head off? He knows I'm not seriously gonna do it but I'm just needing to vent. Do I deserve to be on a watch list for that? Where do you draw the line? And what about people's mental health who now feel like there's no safe place to express their dark side safely?
     
  13. I understand what you are saying. But what if your toughts are not just toughts? Yes US constitution grants you the freedom of speach. But at the same time the 5th amendment grants your neighbour the right of life. So what authorities should do? Protect your freedom of speach or the right of life of your neighbour?
     
  14. That's a good question. Do you think it's ok to punish someone for their thoughts?
     
  15. Punish just for toughts? Depends...if keep the toughts for you then shouldn't be any pubishment. But maybe a surveillance would be needed in order to protect your neighbour's right of life.
     
  16. You don't consider being surveilled a form of punishment?

    Now everything I do is being watched and recorded because I thought about murdering my neighbor?

    How many people do you think have that thought every day, and should they all be under surveillance?
     
  17. But US Constitution, same as constitutions of all states, is mostly just words with no substance. Freedom... are you really free? Buy a Ferrari and drive with 200miles/hour. Are you free to do so without a punishment? Freedom of speech... say publicly that you totally dislike whites/blacks/asians. People won't judge you because you have your freedom of speech? And my favourite one "right of happiness" =)) you can find it in every constitution out there.
     
  18. In that case i think surveillance would be prevention and not punishment.
     
  19. What if your neighbour manage to get a restriction order. Wouldn't be against US constitution? I mean your freedom will be limited, no?
     
  20. I don't think you can get a restraining order for someone else's thoughts.


    You can drive a Ferrari 200 mph on a race track. I can't hide my notes app contents from the Feds anywhere.

    There's no safe space for me to express my truest thoughts.

    I'm a good person. I obey the law. But I have evil thoughts that I like to discuss with close friends or write them down. Everyone does this. I think I should be able to do that through my phone freely. I could just as easily do it without my phone. I can meet friends in person and say whatever I want. I could say that I'm gonna murder the president and it wouldn't be recorded anywhere for the Feds to find. But using a phone to do it suddenly makes it prohibited.

    That's where I draw the line. When I have to fear my own thoughts because I'm using a phone to express them is when I stop using my phone. For now, I get the general sense that the contents of my phone are relatively safe from prying eyes because I'm not transmitting them over unsecure channels. But if that changes then I might just have to give up my phone.