Kingdom of Snoops: A Proposal to Limit Spy Domination

Discussion in 'Strategy' started by The_Philosopher, Jan 21, 2013.

  1. One unfortunate aspect of KaW in its present form is that it is totally dominated by spy builds, becoming a KoS: kingdoms of snoops. OSW, SW, EE-all are dominated by the spy builds.

    Unfortunately this is a far cry from the image we have of war. When we Americans decided to send troops over the Atlantic to fight Germany, for instance, we sent millions and millions of soldiers, not millions and millions of spies. In kaw, however, my spy builds are constantly asked to come and help with this or that war, but my attack builds rarely get this invitation. Is there any way to bring back the pride of the attack build without penalizing those who prefer to fight spy? Let's explore the problem.

    History and Structure of the Spy Build

    The devs were faced with a real problem when they decided to introduce the spy build: how do you make a build special but not better? How do you make players want a few spy buildings but not too many?

    The main advantages of a spy have nothing to do with stealth. As I see it, the big advantages of the spy are as follows:

    1. Through the steal, they have the ability of continuously attacking an enemy without the enemy ever going dtw as long as their is gold out. This allows the possibility of the huge strips we see in osw.
    2. Through the assassin, they have the ability to attack both spy troops and attack troops at the same time, while attack troops can never touch spy troops.
    3. With a pinned hansel build, they have the ability to be dtw to attack even though actually maintaining 98% of their troops, making them a formidable force in sw.

    In order to balance this the devs made spy builds cost more but give less plunder bonus than attack builds. Steals also didn't pay particularly well, making it hard for pure spies to grow. This was designed to discourage too many people from going spy, thus maintaining a dominance of attack builds.

    What the devs didn't count on however, was the pwar era. Pwars brought along a gluttony a new spy builds, to the point where their numbers rivaled those of attack builds. By taking all the pwar tax, a HLBC pure spy could be made in a matter of weeks. Pwars allowed hansels to succeed by allowing them to combine steal plunder with attack plunder to also grow quickly. As a result, what was supposed to be a secondary means of attack quickly became the most feared and dominate force in the game. Want to ruin a clan? Send a clan full of ally-less pure spies against them and strip them while they sleep. This is what Yafi did to Osiris, and what Voodoo did to IG. It is a little sad, however, because instead of becoming a game where we fight builds head on with dignity, we become players who skunk around and wait for our opponents to sleep before stealing all their possessions.

    Rescuing the Attack Build from Extinction

    Is there any hope for the attack build? Any solution presented should not penalize players who have put the time and effort into spy builds, meaning a reduction in spy build plunder of a limit on spy characteristics would not be welcomed. The only solution I see would be the introduction of new lands.

    The Case for New Lands

    Before everyone lets out a collective groan, let me explain. The new lands (call them, for example, the Hell lands coming out of that devilish-looking skull), would have the restriction that no spy builds would be built on them. Only attack builds can be present on these lands.

    How would this affect Kaw?

    Such a change would present an interesting option for attack builds. They could either
    1) keep their present builds and go for outrageous plunder scores or
    2) convert highland/lowland builds to spy/ spy towers to protect against the strip.

    The first option would give the attack builds a way to out-earn hansels, and try to gain an advantage via ally hires. The second option would allow them to sleep a little easier at night, knowing they are much harder to strip.

    Such a development would also benefit spy builds in a sense. They would get bigger plunder when they steal attack builds that choose not to convert lands over to towers. On the other hand there will be less builds they can strip effectively, since many players would choose to convert lowlands/highlands into spies. True hansels (one attack build, rest spies) would largely transform into hybrids, meaning their dtw advantage of retaining 98% troops would be reduced to a mere 60% , a much more level playing field for sw. In this way the spy builds are not necessarily artificially weakened, but attack builds would then measure better against the spy. Attack builds would find a new popularity and thus create a better attack/spy build ratio throughout kaw.

    When I first downloaded KaW I had visions of facing down an opponent on the field of battle. Therefore it was a little disappointing to me to see that the majority of osw action involved basically waiting for them to fall asleep, stab them in the back, and strip all their gold. While not a perfect solution, I believe the introduction of Attack build only lands would go a long way into repairing the damage caused during the pwar/hansel era.

    Constructive criticism most welcome. Cheers!
     
  2. Surprisingly I support
     
  3. Ee wars are dominated by spies support
     
  4. The main point is to give attack builds a way to defend themselves without necessarily penalizing spy builds. The pwar era upset the balance in Kaw, and this might be a way to correct that a bit.
     

  5. OSW is also too dominated by spies. Attack builds are basically just fresh meat.
     
  6. That's why you go tower build just have to be dedicated since its not 40% anymore, I think it's 75% towers needed.
     
  7. EE wars arnt dominated by spies because a clan full of attack builds Vs spies means the spies can't get a successful hit and will gain no plunder. All the attack build needs to do is unload troops then SKO an repeat and not leak plunder from KO's
     

  8. I'm not really a fan of tower builds either. lol
     
  9. Totally agree with this lets get this put into the game
     

  10. Your advice hinges on the belief that SKO is an easy thing to do. However the more builds you got attacking you, the less likely you can SKO. One spy advantage is they can effectively elminate both attack and spy troops at the same time, making the odds of them getting a KO much higher.
     
  11. I'm not sure attack only lands are the best solution but I do like the idea. Only problem is I think it would lead to a lot of conversions, as you mentioned, essentially moving most players builds more to the middle and taking a lot of the diversity out of the game
     
  12. Would require a large amount of gold for conversions, yay.
     
  13. @ delta

    What diversity is there in Kaw now? Its all spy spy spy.
     
  14. Support, or: since spies have 3 options of attk give troops a second option, raid. This attk focuses on hitting spies and has decreased plunder results. Give attk builds a way to hit spies.
     
  15. i don't not support this.
     
  16. While I really like the area of where you're going with that, if you start to put out restrictions.. Builds will start to once again all resemble the same style

    So I'm iffy, I want attack to play a larger role in wars.. But I'm worried limiting spies isn't the right way about it. Interesting
     
  17. Sort the mechanics out to what they were before. Attack builds always use to be dtw to stls if pinned! Why this changed I have no idea! At least this way you can pin a comrade rather than him being open for the majority of the time!